GasBuddy News Article

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Gold Award: Electric Car Recharging Station

www.businessweek.com -- One day, recharging stations for electric cars might be much more common than gas stations. If NewDealDesign has its way, they won't look at all the same, however. The San Francisco design shop has teamed up with e-car venture Better Place to create the Charge Spot, an electricity outlet that received the gold medal in 2009's International Design Excellence Awards.

NewDealDesign, founded and financed by Gadi Amit, its president, borrowed from its experience with consumer-electronics clients such as Dell (DELL), Fujitsu, Nokia (NOK), and Palm (PALM) to create the Charge Spot. The slender and sleek column looks a bit like a sidewalk traffic barrier with a blue plastic top. Amit calls it a "mini-tower of electric power."

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Submitted Aug 04, 2009 By: Chasms

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Author	Topic: Gold Award: Electric Car Recharging Station	Topic is locked Back to Topics

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Jarod13 Champion Author Virginia Posts:3,470 Points:1,050,505 Joined:Oct 2008	Message Posted: Aug 5, 2009 12:37:09 PM Ignore Jarod13 Report Abuse Too many uncertainties involved with electric cars! Time to recharge, are current batteries the rechargeable type and the infrastructure costs involved in supporting the recharging of an electric vehicles batteries. Until these questions, as well as many others are answered, electric vehicles are something to look forward to in the future!
jppezz Champion Author New Mexico Posts:6,235 Points:1,226,655 Joined:Jun 2008	Message Posted: Aug 5, 2009 7:11:36 AM Ignore jppezz Report Abuse If electric cars are to the cars of the future than you need a car that will go a long way and when a charge is needed it will take a short time to charge, other wise forget it. I still think the hydrogen fuel cell is the best idea for the vehicles we need.
wwcj Champion Author Virginia Posts:1,582 Points:383,715 Joined:Jul 2008	Message Posted: Aug 5, 2009 7:05:47 AM Ignore wwcj Report Abuse I would charge at home. What is the cost to buy the car and to charge?
72_Monte Champion Author Twin Cities Posts:5,439 Points:1,533,255 Joined:Aug 2005	Message Posted: Aug 5, 2009 7:02:47 AM Ignore 72_Monte Report Abuse We'll be charging these things at home, in all likelihood.
jimshell Champion Author Pennsylvania Posts:2,102 Points:591,945 Joined:Sep 2004	Message Posted: Aug 5, 2009 7:02:04 AM Ignore jimshell Report Abuse How will that be charged and what is cost? Still a lot of questions need to be answered.
thwadi Champion Author Cleveland Posts:2,553 Points:897,830 Joined:Mar 2008	Message Posted: Aug 5, 2009 7:00:51 AM Ignore thwadi Report Abuse We are better off focusing on producing an electric car that meets the average days use of the car. 50 mile range will cover most peoples driving for normal use. Develop some point to point transport for people and cars that can get from major city to major city in a more efficient way than driving for 4 to 10 hours.
weenerdog Champion Author Detroit Posts:7,344 Points:1,439,685 Joined:Jan 2008	Message Posted: Aug 5, 2009 7:00:12 AM Ignore weenerdog Report Abuse this is the stumbling block to electric cars, if you run out of a charge it will take a lot longer to get home than filling your gas tank
LeeFree Champion Author Pittsburgh Posts:6,829 Points:1,783,975 Joined:Jun 2005	Message Posted: Aug 5, 2009 6:59:52 AM Ignore LeeFree Report Abuse Charging time is the biggest factor for success.
RayJayT Champion Author Mississippi Posts:5,477 Points:1,122,980 Joined:Aug 2008	Message Posted: Aug 5, 2009 6:58:16 AM Ignore RayJayT Report Abuse We will see how this works
unicornpmb Champion Author Buffalo Posts:6,122 Points:1,163,450 Joined:Sep 2005	Message Posted: Aug 5, 2009 6:51:55 AM Ignore unicornpmb Report Abuse The only way electric cars will sell if people know there will be enough charging stations.
winggnutt Champion Author Detroit Posts:6,332 Points:1,431,625 Joined:Aug 2005	Message Posted: Aug 5, 2009 6:49:51 AM Ignore winggnutt Report Abuse need to develop a system of replaceable batteries....then there would be little reason to not go electric!
colt453162 All-Star Author Houston Posts:625 Points:305,895 Joined:Mar 2008	Message Posted: Aug 5, 2009 6:47:53 AM Ignore colt453162 Report Abuse Would this be that convenent? If you did need a charge, hopefully you would not be in a hurry.
Beboper Champion Author Virginia Posts:6,367 Points:1,697,865 Joined:Oct 2005	Message Posted: Aug 5, 2009 6:45:49 AM Ignore Beboper Report Abuse we will wait and see
tankneverfull Champion Author Charlotte Posts:6,374 Points:1,301,065 Joined:Apr 2008	Message Posted: Aug 5, 2009 6:45:45 AM Ignore tankneverfull Report Abuse I guess the only thing missing is the ...CARS!
cheapertvs Champion Author Richmond Posts:7,851 Points:2,275,795 Joined:Jan 2004	Message Posted: Aug 5, 2009 6:45:12 AM Ignore cheapertvs Report Abuse We will see many entries to the market like this before the most economical version takes up most of the market share.
abbyro Veteran Author Michigan Posts:379 Points:452,385 Joined:Apr 2006	Message Posted: Aug 5, 2009 6:44:49 AM Ignore abbyro Report Abuse and in 40-50 years...this will be the way to go...but now, it's all a pipe dream
RoadhogMA Champion Author Boston Posts:4,219 Points:897,095 Joined:Dec 2008	Message Posted: Aug 5, 2009 6:44:44 AM Ignore RoadhogMA Report Abuse What is the cost of a charge ?
Les7h Champion Author Texas Posts:5,364 Points:1,157,125 Joined:Oct 2008	Message Posted: Aug 5, 2009 6:44:19 AM Ignore Les7h Report Abuse How much will a charge be? You can't charge a battery in a short amount of time - these locations would need to be located where people spend long periods of time, Work, motels, ect
fordfan1 Champion Author Indiana Posts:6,736 Points:1,425,090 Joined:Jul 2007	Message Posted: Aug 5, 2009 6:43:49 AM Ignore fordfan1 Report Abuse I hope this all works out and the Government does not tax this to death too.
matifu Veteran Author Florida Posts:334 Points:100,915 Joined:Mar 2009	Message Posted: Aug 5, 2009 6:41:48 AM Ignore matifu Report Abuse And you have to wait 15-30 minutes at the station, forget about it.
LoneGuy Champion Author Lansing Posts:6,153 Points:1,857,755 Joined:Aug 2005	Message Posted: Aug 5, 2009 6:41:40 AM Ignore LoneGuy Report Abuse Are we ready to buy replacement battery racks and pay the carbon tax for drawing recharge power from coal fired generators?
tc316 Champion Author Twin Cities Posts:7,751 Points:1,272,955 Joined:Apr 2007	Message Posted: Aug 5, 2009 6:40:54 AM Ignore tc316 Report Abuse Good luck
gabbygusIN Champion Author Indiana Posts:4,886 Points:1,093,950 Joined:Oct 2008	Message Posted: Aug 5, 2009 6:35:24 AM Ignore gabbygusIN Report Abuse Hmmm.. wonder what they are going to charge you for recharging at these stations???
Paw5X Champion Author Gary Posts:7,754 Points:1,880,120 Joined:May 2005	Message Posted: Aug 5, 2009 6:32:26 AM Ignore Paw5X Report Abuse Electric vehicles need some major upgrades.
FuelBarge Champion Author Long Island Posts:6,806 Points:1,610,365 Joined:Aug 2005	Message Posted: Aug 5, 2009 6:29:32 AM Ignore FuelBarge Report Abuse I don't see electric car charging stations ever being as convenient as a gasoline station. Barring any major technical advances, you can still push more energy in the form of gasoline, in a given amount of time, than you can electricity.
ttwiw Champion Author Austin Posts:2,166 Points:1,299,560 Joined:Sep 2005	Message Posted: Aug 5, 2009 6:28:33 AM Ignore ttwiw Report Abuse I think battery swaps will be more common than recharge stations
nurdco Champion Author Colorado Springs Posts:6,598 Points:1,228,485 Joined:Apr 2008	Message Posted: Aug 5, 2009 6:28:21 AM Ignore nurdco Report Abuse IT will NOT be FREE...
katmandue Champion Author Detroit Posts:5,754 Points:1,678,090 Joined:Jul 2006	Message Posted: Aug 5, 2009 6:25:33 AM Ignore katmandue Report Abuse need solar powered recharging stations.
MidnightSun Champion Author New Hampshire Posts:41,668 Points:1,106,175 Joined:Nov 2007	Message Posted: Aug 5, 2009 6:25:33 AM Ignore MidnightSun Report Abuse I enjoyed your reads. GM has lithium batteries for their hybid. Check out the 2010 Chevy Volt 150 mpg! (no misprint). 40 miles on no gas. $32,500
NJColt Champion Author New Jersey Posts:10,360 Points:2,181,410 Joined:Aug 2005	Message Posted: Aug 5, 2009 6:24:08 AM Ignore NJColt Report Abuse Now, watch the prices of re-fueling. Guaranteed its as much or more than gas. We'll NEVER win.
JNewkirk All-Star Author Arkansas Posts:809 Points:618,805 Joined:Sep 2005	Message Posted: Aug 5, 2009 6:24:03 AM Ignore JNewkirk Report Abuse Get me a quick-charger for my electric scooter, then we'll talk.
dave364 Champion Author Lansing Posts:3,206 Points:1,009,330 Joined:Nov 2007	Message Posted: Aug 5, 2009 6:21:19 AM Ignore dave364 Report Abuse good for them good luck
applejoe Champion Author Twin Cities Posts:3,630 Points:766,320 Joined:May 2001	Message Posted: Aug 5, 2009 6:20:27 AM Ignore applejoe Report Abuse It's good we have our minds all working on a solution, just so the government doesn't get in the way.
pitamon Champion Author Philadelphia Posts:3,652 Points:1,496,860 Joined:Sep 2004	Message Posted: Aug 5, 2009 6:19:31 AM Ignore pitamon Report Abuse How much will a charge be?
QueenMother Champion Author New Hampshire Posts:5,188 Points:1,704,220 Joined:May 2006	Message Posted: Aug 5, 2009 6:18:14 AM Ignore QueenMother Report Abuse Can't wait to see it happen.
cathevan Champion Author Manitoba Posts:2,177 Points:544,105 Joined:May 2007	Message Posted: Aug 5, 2009 6:17:13 AM Ignore cathevan Report Abuse i wonder what they will "charge" for this service
Beau2140 Champion Author New York Posts:5,941 Points:1,191,235 Joined:Oct 2008	Message Posted: Aug 5, 2009 6:14:51 AM Ignore Beau2140 Report Abuse The fur ture seems so far off, but it getting closer fast.
lindact Champion Author New Haven Posts:6,492 Points:1,271,485 Joined:May 2008	Message Posted: Aug 5, 2009 6:13:00 AM Ignore lindact Report Abuse It will take time, but with ingenuity we will get there.
Bonanza Champion Author Boston Posts:9,300 Points:2,087,030 Joined:Jun 2004	Message Posted: Aug 5, 2009 6:12:06 AM Ignore Bonanza Report Abuse It will be interesting to see how electric vehicles effect the price of electricity.
Dkrdj5 Champion Author Jacksonville Posts:4,820 Points:764,250 Joined:May 2009	Message Posted: Aug 5, 2009 6:11:50 AM Ignore Dkrdj5 Report Abuse golf cart works for me.
paoli8 Champion Author Philadelphia Posts:4,910 Points:1,379,460 Joined:Jul 2007	Message Posted: Aug 5, 2009 6:10:26 AM Ignore paoli8 Report Abuse If you want an electric car, get a golf cart.
subnuke Champion Author Atlanta Posts:5,213 Points:1,049,520 Joined:Sep 2008	Message Posted: Aug 5, 2009 6:09:44 AM Ignore subnuke Report Abuse How long to cahrge - it it is longer than about 5 minutes - forget it.
05HD All-Star Author Cincinnati Posts:559 Points:105,295 Joined:Jan 2008	Message Posted: Aug 5, 2009 6:09:38 AM Ignore 05HD Report Abuse 2 TO 3 MIN. TO GAS UP HOW LONG TO RECHARGE.TRIPS WOULD BE FUN,HOW MUCH LONGER DAD.
Redink Champion Author Indianapolis Posts:5,043 Points:886,305 Joined:Aug 2005	Message Posted: Aug 5, 2009 6:05:17 AM Ignore Redink Report Abuse Unless the charge is quick, it won't help on long drives.
w4kh Champion Author Riverside Posts:9,316 Points:1,763,150 Joined:May 2004	Message Posted: Aug 5, 2009 6:04:00 AM Ignore w4kh Report Abuse When a good electric commuter vehicle shows up, I will certainly consider it... even an electric plug-in hybrid
Petrock Champion Author Lexington Posts:6,767 Points:2,091,895 Joined:Apr 2005	Message Posted: Aug 5, 2009 6:03:29 AM Ignore Petrock Report Abuse This plan sounds cute, but if I were to buy an electric car I don't envision charging it many time except in my garage. From this perspective, I am guessing that electric "gas stations" will have a very hard way to go for a long time. Charging stations at work, motels and perhaps shopping malls will come first.
Hunter724 Champion Author New Hampshire Posts:5,762 Points:1,180,190 Joined:Sep 2008	Message Posted: Aug 5, 2009 6:01:52 AM Ignore Hunter724 Report Abuse Have to wait and see..
GasholeMI Champion Author Lansing Posts:7,778 Points:1,252,665 Joined:Jul 2008	Message Posted: Aug 5, 2009 6:00:41 AM Ignore GasholeMI Report Abuse I will wait and see.
theawesome1 Champion Author Cleveland Posts:6,978 Points:1,304,360 Joined:Aug 2005	Message Posted: Aug 5, 2009 6:00:32 AM Ignore theawesome1 Report Abuse Too bad no solar cars, much more than Toyota's solar running AC, etc
pgerassi Champion Author Milwaukee Posts:8,521 Points:1,667,725 Joined:Apr 2007	Message Posted: Aug 5, 2009 5:55:09 AM Ignore pgerassi Report Abuse Typically there are three major factors in time to recharge, max charge rate expressed in C (1C is the capacity of the battery from full charge discharged in an hour to the cutoff voltage), the DOD (Depth Of Discharge usually expressed in percent of 1C) and the power available to the charger. You can't charge a 10KWH battery (say 48V at 210AH) in an hour with only a 20A 120V wall outlet. Most energy storage optimized batteries used in cars have a max charge rate of 1C. High power optimised batteries used in mild hybrids can charge at up to 8C. Also as most batteries get to nearly full charge, the charger switches from constant current charging to constant voltage charging. That means that the last few percent of charge occurs as charging current diminishes rapidly. Thus a 1C intital charge rate takes roughly 57 minutes to get to 95% charge from 0% charge and another 18 minutes to add the last 5% for a total of 1.25 hours. Some high end chargers go into a balancing the battery mode (charge each cell in a battery to the same voltage) that takes even longer typically another 10-20 minutes for a reasonably balanced battery. Also if that 10KWH battery has a 5% DOD, it takes only 18 minutes to charge using a 240V 50A outlet (electric stove size). But a 10KWH battery discharged to the typical 75% DOD (3K charges lifetime for a LiFePO4 battery to a final 80% of capacity) for EVs on a standard 120V 20A wall socket takes about 3.5 hours including balancing. 7.5KWHs used in an EV translates to about 50-75 miles of range. Thus 3K cycles at 75% at 50-75 miles (90% average total capacity) mean that the lifetime of the battery is about 135-202K miles. As the max range gets smaller, most cars reduce the max DOD to 60% which increases the life to 6-8K cycles keeping the lifetime in miles about the same or slightly smaller. A commuter car sized precisely uses only 250 charges (charge at home only) to 500 charges (charged both at home and at work) per year to do commuting, so 6-8K cycles means 16 to 24 years between battery swaps.